Lacey Hayes: The EOS Tools That Transformed a $45M Business

Lacey Hayes  00:00

If you go home after this meeting and you call someone that was on the team to vent and debrief, then you were not open and honest in the meeting. Every business has a why bigger than making money, and it doesn't have to be even related to the business itself. You know, it's just the reason all of you get together and do your work every day.

Debra Chantry-Taylor  00:30

Welcome to another episode of Better Business, Better Life. I'm your host, Debra Chantry-Taylor, and I'm passionate about helping entrepreneurial business owners and their leadership teams lead a better life. Today, I am joined by one of my fellow EOS implementers. She has spent 10 years working in hospice rolling out EOS across 32 offices. She believes that you have to have healthy tension and conflict in a business to really make a difference, and she's helped a business grow from 45 million to $78 million using EOS. What she's going to share with you today is how having a strong common purpose gives teams a reason to work through tension, and can help to create healthy conflict. So everybody's fighting for the greater good. I'd like to introduce you to Lacey Hayes as a professional EOS implementer working with EOS worldwide. So welcome to the show, Lacey. It's lovely to see you again. We've been having a few chats offline, and I've learned a lot about you. I'm looking forward to you sharing your story with our listeners.

Lacey Hayes  01:27

Yeah, it's nice to see you again.

Debra Chantry-Taylor  01:29

Yeah, thank you. Hey, look, we were just talking about so you before becoming an EOS implementer, you actually worked in the hospice space for 10 years, and it was there that you got introduced to Eos, and it started to become part of your life. Tell us a little bit about that journey. Tell us you know, how you got to, how you got to be working in hospice, first of all, and then the journey into the Eos.

Lacey Hayes  01:51

So for hospice, it really wasn't anything intentional for so for how I ended up in hospice, I had a I was looking for marketing, communication, sales positions whenever I was applying for jobs. And it just so happens that I was able to get this job at one of the most amazing companies I've ever worked at, and I still think they're just phenomenal at what they do. And I was introduced to EOS at that hospice company, we had an EOS implementer come in. His name was Ken DeWitt. He's an expert implementer now, and a great mentor of mine, and we had him come in to implement to help us implement EOS. And actually, in that meeting, I was brought in. I was still in marketing, but they didn't have an executive assistant. They were asked if I could come in and take some notes for him. It was our very first session day, and Ken, I remember him saying that every decision that you make in this room, it drastically impacts you or every employee you have, plus at least five people that depend on them, financially, emotionally or physically. And so that was really all I needed to hear for me to really feel obligated to speak up, even though I was just there to take notes. So once we hired an executive assistant, I still stayed in the room on the leadership team, and I helped. I had a rock 90 day priority to help deploy EOS through our 32 offices, and I would lead EOS quarterly sessions for our four regional teams. And after 10 years of doing that, I decided to take a leap of faith and do this full time on my own. And I feel just so grateful to do this work. I love it.

Debra Chantry-Taylor  03:35

Yeah, I'm the same. It's been a like a game changer for me. I mean, I've been coaching for sort of 20 odd years and running businesses for 30 odd years, but the EOS tools just brought some real clarity to the work that I had been doing, and a framework that was easy, but not necessarily was that no simple, not necessarily easy, I think probably the right way to say it. It's very, very simple. It's not necessarily easy, but it gives you that framework to work within. So okay, at the hospice Summit, how big was this hospice?

Lacey Hayes  03:59

So we were around 400 employees when we first started, so a little bit larger than your typical EOS client, but the framework was still perfect for us. And actually we had operating systems and frameworks that we utilise, but they were talk about simple. They really weren't that simple, and they accomplished pretty much what EOS accomplished, except for it was in terms that everyone in our organisation was able to quickly pick up without having to do a bunch of research on business strategy or execution tactics.

Debra Chantry-Taylor  04:34

It is funny, isn't it, there was a lot of systems out there, and they're all very, very good, and nothing wrong with any of any system is better than no system, for sure, but a lot of them do get get quite complicated, and I think that's the challenge. Is that for an organisation with 400 employees, you'd have all different types of people, wouldn't you everything for somebody who's working as a nurse on the floor to somebody who's working administration, and having a common simple language that everybody can understand is just a game changer.

Lacey Hayes  04:59

Yeah, yeah, it really was.

Debra Chantry-Taylor  05:03

So tell me so in terms of the EOS implement, you had Ken. I mean, Ken's a wonderful person. We all love Ken. But what was it about the EOS toolbox? What was the tool that really changed things?

Lacey Hayes  05:16

I suppose, in that business, you know, really, what changed it the most was likely the meeting pulse. So having those rhythms and having departmental meetings, having each office have their own meeting, the level 10, the weekly level 10s, the quarterly EOS sessions, just giving a sec A set aside time for everybody in the organisation to call out an issue and to contribute to solving that issue. Think it was really empowering. I think it brought a lot of equity to the table in terms of making sure everybody's voices were heard, and then also just really leveraging all of the passion, intellect, best practices throughout the entirety of the organisation, so that meeting pulse, keeping us on track, but then just getting the buy in and the feedback from everyone. I know it's just meetings, but the agenda of them and how they're structured can just be really impactful, and it really helps people feel seen, heard and empowered.

Debra Chantry-Taylor  06:16

It is interesting. I mean, if people don't know the level 10 meeting is, I would highly recommend that you Google it and have a look for it. It is a very, very simple structure, and every level 10 meeting, regardless of what level they're at in the organisations, follows the same agenda. Happens on the same day, same time starts on time ends on time. But as you said, it's actually an opportunity for everybody to have input, not only in raising the issues and opportunities, but actually in solving them as well, and it's that, it's that level of engagement that really gives you the accountability and the commitment that then leads the results. So they are phenomenal. So you know, we start with the level 10, media, the leadership team, and I know that I've certainly a lot of clients going to go, oh yeah, it works really, really well for us. But you know, people on the shop floor, they don't have the time, they're not really interested. They don't need to attend a meeting. And of course, I have my answer for them, but I'm just interested to hear from you, because you rolled it out throughout the whole organisation. What was the benefit of having those regular meetings, and how were they perceived in the beginning, and then at the end?

Lacey Hayes  07:17

You know, I think it was in the beginning, rolling them out. And the first thing was, oh gosh, another meeting. And so what we immediately did was get rid of some of the other meetings that we had, because we thought, you know, most of what the level level 10 agenda covers, some of these other ancillary meetings that we have really don't need to exist anymore. So that was the first thing we did, was get rid of some of those other meetings and let EOS and the level 10 meeting replace that. But then also it was just, I think they easily solved the benefit in having the meeting, because there's a lot of times where, you know, the issue solving kind of goes to, you know, the manager, rather than the vertical team that they have. So, you know, there was, it really helped prevent the triangulation in our offices. So there, you know, we had clinical operations and sales in every single office. And so there's always going to be tension there and competing priorities, and having a designated space for that team to get together and work those issues out on their own instead of asking management for input. Think really helped kind of cut through some of the noise and some of the distractions that came prior to implementing that.

Debra Chantry-Taylor  08:34

Okay, fantastic.

Lacey Hayes  08:35

And they loved it too. They loved their level 10 meeting.

Debra Chantry-Taylor  08:38

Yeah, so the level 10 meetings and the meeting pulse in general, not just level 10 meetings, as you said, it is the quarter. Is it? Is the quarterlies. It's the annuals. It's having that whole kind of regular check in teams. Is certainly a major game changer in terms of, you know, when you've got a large organisation like that, you've obviously got people who are very bought into the cause, and so probably quite naturally, share the core values, very passionate about what they're doing. How do you make sure that you have the right structure in an organisation like that? Because it must be a challenging work environment. And just keen to hear a little bit about your experience, about structure within the organisation.

Lacey Hayes  09:12

So structure in terms of of like our accountability chart and and in that regard. And you know, there's so hospices interdisciplinary, there is a social worker, a chaplain, nurse, CNAs, hospice aides as well as physicians. So there are a lot of different ways that you can structure that, and how we went about it was to structure it by operational team, so we could do all sales report to each other and and maybe Social Services I'll report on up the ladder, but we thought that the best way for collaboration is to have that interdisciplinary team all stay together and report to one manager. So it really helps kind of prevent those silos, because so much about hospice is the collaboration. Of care. So anything that we could do to prevent the disciplines to become fragmented was really important to us. So whenever we created our accountability chart and our structure, we wanted to make sure that collaboration was reflected in our structure as well.

Debra Chantry-Taylor  10:14

I think it's one of the things that I enjoy about the EOS tools. When they people often say, oh, Eos, it's very cookie cutter, because you're all following this, this framework, but it is just a framework. The Accountability chart that you might put together for hospice will look completely different to an accountability chart for for another organisation. And it's not about being prescriptive in terms of what you do. It's more about here is the tool that can help you pull this all together. How you do that is, is what is best greater for the company? You know, what's the best structure for the company? What company, what is likely to work?

Lacey Hayes  10:44

Yeah, and we changed it. I mean, we didn't always do it that way. We changed it. We tried it this way, and then, you know, then we changed it back. And so, you know, nothing ever is set in stone either with Eos, and it's not really regimented in that regard. It's it's flexible. It's supposed to live and breathe with the business, and I appreciate that as well, in terms of just always improving so whatever, the best thing that needs to be done is, what will, what will then?

Debra Chantry-Taylor  11:13

Yeah, and I think it's a common misconception is that you know that, you know you set this stuff up, and you, once you set it up, it said it's done nothing changes. But it's actually just the opposite. It's actually just the opposite. It's called The Entrepreneurial Operating System for a reason, and it's designed to grow and change with the business as a business grows and changes. And we know that people who might get you to a certain level may not be the roles and the people that will get you to the next level. So it's really important that you actually check in regularly and make sure is it still working for us? What can we do to actually tweak that? What we know? What needs refining?

Lacey Hayes  11:41

Yeah, that's actually one of my favourite things about running a systematic business, is that if you're constantly repeating those same steps, those same proven processes, it makes opportunities for improvement become so much more obvious, and then you're able to spot those patterns and spot those trends, because you are operating in a more cyclical, repeatable manner. So I just feel like the opportunity to find improvement is a lot more obvious whenever you are doing things in the same fashion, in the same pattern, in the same rhythm, in the same flow and process.

Debra Chantry-Taylor  12:14

I mean, that's probably one of the biggest components, if you like, of Eos and a lot of businesses, I think, struggle with this if they've grown, I guess maybe in a more established, bigger business, not so much, but definitely in the smaller businesses they they've been so used to being multi disciplined, everybody jumping in, everybody kind of helping out, that there hasn't been a a way to structure the process. And I think I heard you say earlier on in one of my conversations, you know, if you can get the process right, means you'll focus on the process rather than the people in terms of the way the business run.

Lacey Hayes  12:44

Yeah, so that that was kind of a personal philosophy of mine. If I'm on the leadership team and I'm expected to lead an organisation, I want to be harder on processes than I am people, because part of my job as someone on the leadership team is to own the processes in my functional area, and so I want those processes to be as clear and efficient as they can possibly be. One of my favourite questions to ask employees is, just what's the most frustrating part of your job and and how can I create a process to eliminate that, eliminate that frustration, or if there's a particular complaint that we're getting or customer service issue. Well, what's in the process? Obviously, if this is happening often, then it's not as clear. It's not as easy as I thought it was. So what can I do differently? How can we change the process and change the way we train people on it, and that way we can retain those right people and help what I like to do is I want to make it as easy as possible for good people to do good work. So if you're a good person, I'll do anything I can to keep you and you know, it doesn't always happen, but it's it's to find the right person in your organisation is so important. And I think if your process component is really strong, then it's easier to have people be able to get it and want it, and then have the capacity to do it, because it's easy to get it whenever the expectations are really clear, and it's easy to want it whenever it's not frustrating, then the capacity is just gonna be getting catching people up to speed that might otherwise need to be trained is gonna be quicker as well, because training is so clear based on the processes.

Debra Chantry-Taylor  14:18

I love it. Now, you've used the terminology there, right people, and maybe some people listening in for the first time might not know what that really means. This is a bit of an EOS terminology we talk about, right people, right seats. What does that mean?

Lacey Hayes  14:29

So yeah, right people. Those are people that adhere to your core values. They live and breathe by your core values, which are really just the guiding characteristics of your organisation. So whatever you want your company culture to be like, that should be your core values, and then all your employees should reflect those core values.

Debra Chantry-Taylor  14:47

And then the right seat is obviously about being in that right role, that role that they excel at, that they're really great at. They go give them talent, unique ability, whatever them call it, so they get it. They want it. They have a capacity. Did you ever have any wrong people that you had to do with?

Lacey Hayes  15:00

Yeah, I think so. And you know, it's one of those things. I think it's easy. In a growth position, a sales position, you know, in a leadership position, there's so many things that you have to give your attention to. So if the numbers are good, you might not always address things as quickly as you should. And I definitely think there were times where we held on to a person that was the wrong person in the right seat, because the numbers were really good, but it's one of those things we say it'll kill you in the long run, and it really will. The amount of destruction that they're gonna leave in their wake is not worth the short term achievements that they'll make. But what I think is really important to note there is that we rarely keep those people intentionally it's just because we haven't taken the time to really evaluate whether we have the right people in the right seat. If you don't really take the time to slow down and thoughtfully process that, but then the numbers are where they should be, then nothing's gonna prompt you to take action. And so that's why having those quarterly conversations and utilising the tools to have the EOS tools that to have those conversations, it made it to where you didn't wait until those situations bubbled up and became too hard to deal with.

Debra Chantry-Taylor  16:16

And it's true as I mean, quarterly conversations is a great tool for bringing everything together. It brings in the accountability chart. It brings in the people analyzer, their core values and their GWC. It brings in their rocks that they're focusing on. But so tell me a little bit about the people analyzer. It's a great tool for, you know, understanding if you have those right people in the right seats, but how would somebody practically use it? So, you know, it's a tool where we put our list of our employees in there. We put the core values across the top of them, the GWC, and we, you know, why don't you explain how you used it in the hospice?

Lacey Hayes  16:49

So we actually used it at a regional team level. And our regional team was interdisciplinary as well. And they, I think, you know, a lot of times with Eos, we roll it out for the manager to do it, but we had the regionals do it as a team, because a lot of times there were perspectives that the manager didn't see. And so how we use the people analyzer is you write their name off to the left, and then all your core values on the top, you do a plus if they exhibit that core value most of the time, plus, minus, if it's, you know, 5050, so, so and then, minus if it's less than the majority of the time. And so doing that together as a regional leadership team, it really helped everyone on the team understand the perspective of why someone might be holding on to someone that they don't think is the right fit, or, I don't know, it also helped us not roll out certain initiatives to solve problems. It really helped get down to the root cause of a lot of problems as well. So being able to utilise that and then, but what we would do, before any disciplinary action would happen, is to just have a conversation, being open and honest. And we at the company I was at, we called it care enough to confront. So if you care enough about that person and the business, then you'll confront them with their behaviour, and hopefully they'll do what they can to rectify it. And honestly, a lot of times in healthcare and in hospice, especially, the job is so stressful. I mean, it is a really hard, hard work. And if someone is not acting in accordance to our values or the values that they report to have. I usually always think that's worth a conversation, because to me, it's telling that something else might be going on. They might not be happy at their job, they might not be happy at home. But the type of manager I want to be is to have a conversation, figure out what the root cause is for why they may or may not be adhering to those values, and figure out how we can get them up to speed and up to standards.

Debra Chantry-Taylor  18:49

Yeah, and that's the beauty of the tool. It is designed to make a leader's job easier, to understand what the real issue is, and then have the conversations around it, be specific around examples, make sure that we're working, because we all want to see our people perform at their absolute best. And I what you're talking what you're talking about that care enough to to confront is that the radical candour philosophy isn't it's like, actually, if you really, really care about your people, you do want them to know what's going on. Because sometimes it hits them out of the blue. Sometimes they you know, they go, I have no idea that is how it was perceived. Or I had no idea that the way that I spoke to somebody was was taken that way. And so it can be a an eye opener for them, and it gives them an opportunity to to improve themselves.

Lacey Hayes  19:27

And sometimes you just you learn so much about these people. You know they have whole lives at home that have nothing to do with their jobs. And then you realise what they're dealing with and what they're having to carry to their work every single day. And then on top of it, this type of work is really emotionally and physically and mentally challenging, and so being able to find a way to kind of combat that fatigue that sets in just from natural work and life, you can kind of do that together. With between a manager and and a direct report by just getting to know them and getting to know what they're going through.

Debra Chantry-Taylor  20:06

I also love the check ins of the level 10 for that same thing as well. I think it's really interesting. You know, we always start with good news, professional and personal. And, you know, just starting every single meeting like that, it means every week you're getting a little insight into the personal life of the people that you're working with, and I think that provides a beautiful connection. It builds the trust, it builds the ability to kind of share more vulnerably the things I find out about the teams I've worked with, at times, it's like, wow, I had no idea that's what you do in your spare time. And there's some pretty talented people out there as well.

Lacey Hayes  20:35

My leadership teams, let me tell you, yeah, and you know, I actually so I say this a lot when my clients, I tell them how my team, I came from, they were a really high performing team, and I was, I'm just feel so grateful and lucky that I was able to work with them, but we were also pretty confrontational, like very high conflict and so, and I think that was because we were all so passionate about the nature of our work, and so I always joke that was really good for me to hear about their personal life before we we got to the debating and the arguing I need. I need to hear about how they're a great father and they're a great husband and and they're doing all of these things that that are very deeply human, because we were all very respectful of each other, but we still, like got heated in there, because, again, we just really cared about the purpose of our business, and we we were all fighting for the the greater good, so we had trust and respect in that regard, that that's what the intention of this conflict was. But we were definitely a high, confrontational team, and I didn't realise how rare that was until I started becoming an EOS implementer and working with other clients. And it's kind of funny. I thought, after working in my company and leading these meetings for our regional team, I felt like I really mastered this skill of managing and facilitating conversations that are really emotionally charged and also high confrontation. And that's really not the issue I see with my clients. Really the issue is creating that environment so people feel comfortable being open and honest and confident enough to have an experience that conflict.

Debra Chantry-Taylor  22:10

I think it's one of the most important bits of work we actually do as an EOS implement. Sure the framework, you know, enables this, but we are actually helping them to get comfortable with being uncomfortable, to understand that conflict is not a negative, you know, it's one of the best things that can really happen if it's done in a caring and respectful way, because that is when you really get people engaged involved, then they can commit to the outcomes they have accountability for. They're going to want to do it. But often I see it, I think, I think a little bit more so in Australia and New Zealand is where I work, because I think Americans maybe have a little bit are brought up slightly differently, but over here, little passive aggressive type behaviours. And so people will sit in a meeting and nod and agree and go, yes, yes, yes, yes, yes. And then, you know, outside of that meeting, completely different opinion. So part of our role as an EOS implementer is to keep building that trust within the team and encourage them to take those those difficult conversations get uncomfortable, because it will, in the long term, it produces so much better results.

Lacey Hayes  23:08

Yeah, well, I'm in the south, here in America, and it is definitely very similar to what you said. It is. They are very kind and very, very nice and very polite. And so my team was, was kind of an anomaly. But I like to say to my clients, if you go home after this meeting and you call someone that was on the team to vent and debrief, then you were not open and honest in the meeting. So that, I think that kind of puts them like reflection. If you want to have a meeting after the meeting, then you didn't do what we wanted you to do. You weren't honest. And that is something that, when you kind of change it from that perspective of, it's not about being nice, it's about being honest. And honesty is such a strong value. I mean, everybody wants to have, but I think that kind of helps shift the perspective of, you know, being honest is, is more important in the in this context, than than being nice.

Debra Chantry-Taylor  24:01

Yeah, yeah, I love it. Okay, so you obviously switched from 10 years in hospice to being an EOS implementer. That's how much you loved EOS. Tell me a little bit about that journey and what you are now doing.

Lacey Hayes  24:13

So, yeah, I'm working with leadership teams to implement EOS in their business, and I'm leading these conversations that help with their vision. Where are they going to go? How they going to get their traction, making sure their team's working with discipline and accountability. And my favourite part is just the healthy part, making sure that as they set those lofty goals and they're working really hard to get there, that they take the time to, like, reflect on their achievements, be proud of what they've accomplished, and then just work really well together. That was something Ken had to do with us a lot. Is when you're dealing with high achievers, and you know, if you're working with a leadership team, then they likely all are, they can be really hard on themselves. So for me, and this might not be across the board, but for my team, and a lot of the teams that I work on. And work with they need to. It's good for them to, for me to hold up that mirror and show them the progress that they've made. Because when you're in the thick of it, and you have your head down and you're working as hard as you can, it's sometimes hard to feel like you're ever doing enough. And so that is a part, an aspect of my job that I didn't realise I would be doing so much of. And it's, it's really fulfilling as well. And I, you know, I have high standards for excellence, but then I also really want people to be aware whenever they just just working towards excellence, in itself is enough to be rewarded. And so I like being the one that says, hey, let's slow down and really think about what we did, we accomplished a lot, and celebrate.

Debra Chantry-Taylor  25:43

I mean, I think that's the thing, is that a lot of teams there that date, as you said, they can be very tough on themselves, and they don't actually get a chance to reflect and celebrate even the small wins, you know, and that's part of the level 10 meeting helps with that. But the quarterly is definitely reviewing that prior quarter, looking at where we've come from, always we're measuring backwards, it helps them to understand that, because you're right in the thick of it, all they're seeing is the stuff that is going on right here, right now, and it doesn't feel necessarily as good as you look back from that. But look who we came from. Look what we've achieved in that last 90 days. And it's amazing how much can be achieved in 90 days with the right focus.

Lacey Hayes  26:17

Yeah, yeah. And like you said, sometimes you don't even they don't even realise how much they achieved. And that's, again, why it's so important to pause every 90 days, let's look back. How much did we accomplish, where did we come from, and where are we at right now? And then, where do we want to go? And then, just every 90 days, you keep doing that until you eventually get where, where it is that you want it to be lovely.

Debra Chantry-Taylor  26:39

Now I always ask our guests, as they come on, to kind of share three top tips or tools. And the reason for this is, you know, I love, I love doing these interviews. I think, I mean, I don't know if anybody else enjoys listening to them. I love doing them because I learn so much myself every time. But I do want people to walk away with something they can actually do. Because, you know, there's, I think this happens a lot, even in leadership teams, when we first start doing lots of discussion, lots of talk, but no action. And we know that in order to really move forward, we've got to take action. So what would be the three kind of top tips that you have for listeners?

Lacey Hayes  27:07

Okay, so for for leadership, and really for the founder, Owner, visionary of of the business, the top tip is to repeat your vision as often as possible, and really to get more specific your purpose and your values. The founder of the hospice that I worked for, I actually got coffee with him about a month ago, and he said, You need to repeat your purpose and your values to the point where you feel like you are annoying everyone, and then once you once you feel that way, repeat it again. And I think that it is truly that important, because again, when you're in the thick of it and you're just working as hard as you can, and you're in the grind, it's easy to lose sight of the bigger picture and why our work really matters. And you don't have to be in hospice, you don't have to be in healthcare, you don't have to be in a highly emotional industry to have a larger purpose in the work that you're doing. And so I think that's just really important to repeat that as often as possible.

Debra Chantry-Taylor  28:07

And I think you're absolutely right, and I know that, you know, having been an EOS implementer for almost six years now, we go to our quarterlies every quarter with the EOS community. And every time, Mark O'Donnell gets up and he gives a core value speech. And then Kelly takes us through the you know what the plan is for the next quarter. And you would think, if you think about six years, that's 24 times that I've heard that core value speech from the visionary. And in an ordinary organisation, you'll hear a lot more than that. Every time I hear it, I still it just makes my heart sing. It makes you know, you can feel that. It's like, yeah, that's why I'm here. I'm here. I'm part of that bigger vision. That's what I want to do. And I think that's what we forget. Is because we kind of live and breathe it day in day out. As a leadership team, all the people on the shop floor may not necessarily have that, and so bringing them back to that reminder of why we exist, what's our purpose, you know, who are we, how do we operate? Is really, really key.

Lacey Hayes  28:56

And I think sometimes leadership teams are hesitant to do that because they don't want to come off as being disingenuine. But whenever you are repeating it over and over again, and then your actions are aligning with what you say, it's not this corporate fluff. You know, everyone in the organisation is gonna start to feel proud to embody those values, because they know you're doing it's the real thing. It's the real deal. They know you're doing what you say you're doing.

Debra Chantry-Taylor  29:22

Yeah, and you got real big Okay. Number two, what's your tip number two?

Lacey Hayes  29:26

Number two would probably be to just make sure that my these are all really about purpose. So the second thing would to be evaluate. So have a have a purpose for your business, and if you have one evaluate whether or not you and your leadership team truly believe in that purpose. And I'm reminded of that Patrick Lencioni five dysfunctions of a team that you have to have as a leadership team. Great leadership teams have passionate and unfiltered debate, and I don't think that you can truly have that type of. Passionate, unfiltered debate without truly believing in the purpose of your business. And so when you have that purpose statement of of the why of your business and the why is something beyond making money, I think that naturally, your team is going to become a little bit more invested in the conversations around your business. And so, you know, when you have your purpose statement written down, I'd like to ask, like, is this something that you're willing to fight for? Because if it's if it's not, then I don't know if you believe in it enough. And so evaluate whether or not you truly believe in the purpose of your business would be number two.

Debra Chantry-Taylor  30:36

I think that's a really good point. And I think you made the point, it's gonna be more than money. I mean, I think at the end of the day, of course, we go into business or to have a commercial organisation, commercial organisation that will make money, but it isn't motivating for most people to think about a money thing. So making sure your purpose truly has that passion, that heart behind it, as you said, you'd be prepared to fight for it.

Lacey Hayes  30:54

Yeah? And Gino, I was gonna say Gino, yeah. Gino. Wigman, in traction. He says, it needs to be that fire in your belly. And I really, I think that's why we were so non adverse to conflict at the company that I worked for, because we did, we had that fire in our belly. We just wanted the best care possible for our patients. And again, it doesn't have to be dire stakes in order to have a fire in your belly. About the purpose of your business?

Debra Chantry-Taylor  31:24

Yeah, perfect. And last, third and final tip, what would you say?

Lacey Hayes  31:31

To probably going back again to the purpose is to just anchor your hard conversations in that purpose. I think that when your larger vision and purpose and values are shared whenever you give feedback, whenever there's opportunities for improvement. If you anchor those conversations in the context of the bigger picture, it's just a lot less feels a lot less personal. And I also think there's an aspect of it that can be a little bit empowering. You know, if you believe in your purpose and you're holding people accountable to help you achieve that purpose, then you're almost kind of communicating that you believe in them too. And someone, one of the regional leadership team members that I was facilitating the meeting at my at the hospice I worked for. She was the one who kind of helped me see that perspective, that when you are holding people to high standards, it's really just a sign of respect. You're telling them, like, Hey, I believe you're capable of a lot more. And I think that you can really do X, Y and Z to help fulfil the purpose of this business, but this is what I need from you in order to do that. And it's really more of a call to action than it is anything disciplinary. And think that again, just anchoring those conversations in something bigger, rather than like, you know, a petty disagreement or or a small opportunity for improvement. If you anchor it into their purpose and their belief system and their values, then it's just more of a collaborative conversation on, what can we do to get us back on track, instead of a punitive conversation about, you know, falling a little bit short.

Debra Chantry-Taylor  33:24

I completely agree with you. And I've actually got one last question that's kind of come out of that for me as well, is that often when I work with leadership teams, they feel like the people on the shop floor, oh, you know, they won't be interested in this. They won't be interested in sort of the big picture and where we're headed. In your experience, what's it really like?

Lacey Hayes  33:40

You know, I think it can be a little bit twofold. I think they're not interested in it if they only hear about it once a year, and then don't really hear much else from leadership. But, you know, I think that if you again, are just constantly, I was gonna say beating it into their heads, but that's, that's not the good way to put it. But the amount of buy in that our company had around our mission, vision and values and around our owner really was like nothing I've ever seen before. I remember being on a conference call that our owner, and this is 400 plus employees being on there, and we would have, you know, hospice aides, we were going through a challenging period, and our owner was laying out the plan of how we were going to overcome that. And right before everyone jumped off the conference calls, you just kept hearing all these voices saying, You got this, like we got your back. We we're still gonna stick behind you. And we know we can, we can overcome this. And I don't think that's normal. Like, I don't think businesses that don't over emphasise their vision and their purpose and their long term plan. I don't think they they Garner that type of support. And so even if you don't, you might not even know, like, it's not like they were constantly displaying that. That affection, that was just a very specific period that they were able to communicate that to our owner. But I mean, that's still in their thoughts, and that's still in their actions, in their day to day while they're in the business, and then, especially if you start retaining people, and we haven't really talked about accountability chart in depth, but that was the other thing. We were always wanting to grow, and they knew that, and they knew if the company grew, then their opportunities grew as well. So if you're starting to have tenure and longevity in your workforce, and they want to work for you because they think you're a good employer and a good place to work, then they want to grow with you. So they want to know what that long term is going to look like.

Debra Chantry-Taylor  35:40

I think that's absolutely true. And I think you make a real valid point there. It's like, there, especially if they've been around for quite some time, they want to know that there is room for them to grow into other things and and so sharing that journey of growth and sharing where you're headed, and reminding them all the time that what we're trying to do can be really, really valuable. Okay, um, we've, we've talked about quite a lot in here, but I think, you know, some of the core things we've talked about is, you know, you've got to have fire in your belly. Got to know why you why you exist, what you're trying to do, getting those right people who share that, those core values and want to come on that journey with you, getting them into the right seats to make sure they're actually doing what they love and are great at. And really just the that clarity across the organisation. That's where I think EOS really brings home the clarity around who we are, what we do, you know, why we exist, where we're headed. Any final, you know, part final words that you'd like to share with the with the listeners?

Lacey Hayes  36:33

You know, the only thing I can think of is that I was talking about hospice, and naturally, there's going to be passion around that type of business, and I've already alluded to this enough, but every business has a why bigger than making money, and it doesn't have to be even related to the business itself. You know, it's just the reason all of you get together and do your work every day. So you might have to get a little creative, I guess is what I'm trying to say, but there is something that you want that is beyond money. There is some impact you want to make that is beyond money. And so whatever that is, document it. And like I said, repeat it at nauseam, but I don't want to give the impression that you have to have some incredibly high stakes business in order to have this passion. So that's really what I'm trying to replicate for my clients, is, you know, our team had somewhat of an advantage. We were naturally our purpose was just so obvious. It was right there in our face. But in some of these businesses where the purpose, the bigger purpose, the larger picture, the what the beyond the money, might not be as obvious. It might just take some time to really reflect and think about what that is, but there is something there. And so anyways, I just don't want anyone to think that just because your industry or your line of work is more transactional or isn't so dependent on quality of life and people's day to day health doesn't mean that there's not a deeper impact and a deeper purpose that your organisation can can fulfil.

Debra Chantry-Taylor  38:11

And I think sometimes that's a benefit of having an external person come in like an Eos, implement like ourselves, because we dig deeper to try and help them understand that. Because again, you lose sight of it. When you're doing this day in, day out, you forget, perhaps, why you started, or you forget that that shared purpose. And so being able to have those conversations, you know, bringing your leadership team on the journey, getting them to input into that, is just invaluable, because then they understand. Sometimes, I find that, you know, people have done a lot of this work, and they've got their VTO, and we go in there. And we don't actually end up really changing much within the VTO as a self implementer, working with an implementer for the first time. But what we do do is we bring the team on the journey to understand how they got to that. And that is what we want to do with our entire team, is have them understand, you know, you know that what how we got to where we're going, and what we're doing.

Lacey Hayes  38:59

And the other thing I'll add, so being, being from the south, there's they're a humble people, and so I think sometimes having that outside facilitator and that outside perspective can help them see just how much more they're they're offering the world already, because, you know, they don't Want to be too grandiose or or brag on themselves too much. So I think having someone again help hold up that mirror and show them all the great things they're actually accomplishing and doing it helps them define it and really internalise it.

Debra Chantry-Taylor  39:34

Fantastic. Hey, look, we're going to have to wrap up the show, but I've really enjoyed speaking with you. It's been great to kind of get your perspective on things just before we finish up. Tell me a little bit about you know, what is the ideal client for you? Who do you enjoy working with and and what would you recommend if they'd listened to this and thinking, Yes, I wouldn't mind getting some EOS in my business. What would you recommend they do?

Lacey Hayes  39:53

So I love working with clients that are passionate. Obviously, I love working with clients that you. Really wake up every day and want to make the most out of their life. I also have a soft spot for family businesses. My grandmother started her business in 1950 or my mom still worked there. My grandmother is 92 she still works on her feet every day at at the business that she owns, and so I understand the complexity of what that entails. And again, it's just, it's just an issue, you know, it's, I think a lot of people think that family businesses are a lot more convoluted than they actually are. So I kind of enjoy untangling all of those different perspectives and realising the solution is normally something pretty simple. And then lastly, just people that want to grow I'm a pretty competitive person. I grew up playing sports. I like to do what I say I'm going to do. I like to work with people who who do what they say they're going to do. And that's the other thing I like about Eos, is that it's that's not always easy, and that's the point of Eos, is to get good at it. So every 90 days, we're going to say what we're going to do, and then if we don't do it, we'll figure out how to, you know, word it next time, to where we actually do what we say we're going to do. So anyone that's growth oriented or or trying to deal with the complexities of a family business, I really enjoy working with those type of clients.

Debra Chantry-Taylor  41:17

And I think I'm the same. I think we probably sisters from another mother, or whether they call it, but it's Yeah, and family business stuff, I think is really interesting, because you're right, it does add another level of complexity. But again, EOS takes all the emotion out of it. It brings it back to the real issues that the real things that are going on, and enables that business to grow. So I think it's a fantastic tool. Okay, we're going to put your contact details in the bottom of the podcast notes so people can get in contact with you. But again, I just want to say thank you so much for giving us your time today and sharing your wisdom. I really appreciate it. Yeah, thank you. I had fun.